SPIEGEL ONLINE:

Mr. Levin, Nokia announced that in the future it also wants to use Microsoft software in its telephones. Does "cell phone Windows" present a danger to Symbian?

David Levin: One has to separate hype from reality. Every year for the past five Cannes I have seen, there has been some Microsoft announcement like, "here's a big deal ... and by the way Symbian's finished." For five years it has been the same story every year and five years later we are stronger than we were at the beginning. And if you look at the numbers, over 80 percent of all smart phones run on Symbian operating systems. Only 7 percent use Microsoft's Windows Mobile.

SPIEGEL ONLINE: Microsoft, though, has got to be one of the most interesting players because they are so big. They appear to be very persistent and have very deep pockets. Shouldn't one take them more seriously?

David Levin: Clearly they are the one's to worry about because they have infinite resources. But just spending a lot of money doesn't mean they are building anything which is useful.

SPIEGEL ONLINE: But, it seems that they are experiencing more success these days. T-Mobile, for example, a major cell phone network provider in Germany, has a lot of Microsoft smart phones on offer.

David Levin: But how many have sold? If you look at the numbers, you'll see that they haven't sold well at all and you'll see that none of the 10 bestselling phones on the market run on Windows. So you really have to separate the substance from the hype. We have had three consecutive years of more than 100 percent growth and we have licenses across the board in Europe and in Asia.

SPIEGEL ONLINE: The phones we are talking about here -- smart phones -- are really quite complicated. Everyone is saying though that its not just customers in business that want them, but private users as well. Is that true?

David Levin: Absolutely. It's like the car business. A standard, mass-produced, mid-market car now has capabilities people 20 years ago couldn't have imagined. But the complexity has been masked. The engine may be incredibly sophisticated, but the user's experience is much simpler. When the first generation of smart phones came out, they had a lot of features, but were very complex. Now that the second generation is coming out, the complexity is sometimes hidden. For the user it has become much more transparent as to what you have to do to access these features. So yes, I do think these are all moving into the mainstream.

SPIEGEL ONLINE: And yet in Germany, Tchibo -- actually a German coffee company but they are now selling cell phones -- is offering mobile phones that are very simple and can do nothing but send and receive text messages and make phone calls. They appear to be flying off the shelves. Does everybody need to be able to send video, e-mail and that kind of stuff?

David Levin: Of course not. But what you've got here are some basic economic forces. When people are faced with a choice between a vanilla product with nothing and the same product at the same price but with extra features, which one will they choose? They will always choose the one with extra features. As they grow to start using those extra features, they start transforming the way they use the phone. So I think what we will see is the continuous escalation of the features people use on their phones. When I saw my first camera phone in 1998, I couldn't understand why anybody would want a camera phone. I thought it was a crazy idea. But now, what proportion of phones in Japan has a camera? Two-thirds. I think you'll find the exact same dynamic working here with other smart phone features.

SPIEGEL ONLINE: And the market for smart phones does appear to be growing.

David Levin: Yes. In Europe, the market for smart phones grew by 38 percent in the third quarter of 2004. And it will continue to grow. That's what the analysts are saying too.

SPIEGEL ONLINE: You seem pretty confident in consumers' abilities to adapt to complex technologies.

David Levin: Look: Can you imagine not using text messaging now? When I first saw text messaging in 1998, it was clear to me that a system where to right the letter "F" you had to type 333 was going to fail. No question. Terrible concept. I was wrong. The network effect overwhelmed it. I think you will see the same thing happen with all these new features. Once people have worked out that that roaming charges are reasonable, that interconnectivity works and that everybody has it, it will take off. How are you going to send a postcard in the future? You'll send it from your phone.